Cindy-
Thank you for your clarification as well.
The announcement email was already long enough as it was, and thus only a
summary was provided.
The clear point was, once again, that all of this is completely and totally
optional and completely and totally voluntary.
Very simply:
You already know of all of the different meeting formats that we have
rotated through in the past when we were still able to do so. When we are
able to do so again, we will be doing more of the same, while continuing,
as we have from the very beginning, to listen to suggestions (preferably
OFF-list so as to not clutter up the Discussion List with everyone's wish
lists!) and continue to evolve the group to serve the needs and wishes of
the AZIPA Community.
Beyond that, please keep in mind that, irregardless of everything else,
people have been receiving great value from AZIPA for over two years now
without ever having to pay a single cent. Indeed, some people and companies
have made nearly their whole business off of their AZIPA participation...
You would then think that, at the very very very least, people would thus
not hesitate to return a very small fraction of the value that they have
*ALREADY* received from their participation in the group back to the group
that helped create that value in the first place - especially when they
reflect that in doing so, they enable that very same group to be able to
continue to help create even more value for them (and everyone else!) in
the future.
Short version:
Please feel free to consider the completely optional and voluntary fees to
be partial payment to AZIPA for value that you have ALREADY received. If
you have received no value from your participation in AZIPA, then please
give nothing. If you have received value from your participation in AZIPA,
then please consider supporting AZIPA with your completely optional and
voluntary fees. Thank you.
Best,
-Ed
On 12/30/00 at 4:15 AM -0700, Cindy Fox wrote:
> Thanks for the clarification, Ed. :) That's what I think should be posted
> on the email you sent out or on the website to explain the goals for the
> future.
>
> I would be happy to support endeavors of getting speakers or getting better
> meeting places to hear speakers (yes, I couldn't hear a thing in the front
> row of Bash on Ash, even 10 feet from the speakers with Mics).
>
> Does AZIPA plan to have a formal plan? :) IOW, where are we going? :)
> It's lots easier to get somewhere when you know where you're going. :)
>
> I vote for techie things! :) Small Business things! :) Consultant related
> things! :) Others?
>
> Personally, I'm not interested in all the VC stuff. I like being small. :)
> Others?
>
> Take care, c.
>
> Sincerely,
>
>
> Cindy Fox
> Computer Training Solutions
> www.azcts.com
> www.cindyfox.com
> (602) 692-8923
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ed Nusbaum" <ed@azipa.org>
> To: "AZIPA Discussion List" <azipa@egroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2000 3:56 AM
> Subject: Re: [azipa] AZIPA Fees (completely optional and voluntary!)
>
>
>> Cindy-
>>
>> On 12/30/00 at 3:07 AM -0700, Cindy Fox wrote:
>> > What is the money required for? What will it pay for?
>> >
>> > As far as I am aware, Club Rio does not charge.
>>
>> Yes, you are correct that Club Rio does not charge AZIPA, but rather they
>> make their money via sales to AZIPA attendees.
>>
>> But AZIPA is severely limited to be totally dependent upon Club Rio for
>> meeting space.
>>
>> Other spaces of similar or greater size and amenities (convenient and
>> easily accessible location, ample free parking, size and layout of
>> facility, food, and full beverage service) that are also no cost is
>> something that has been sought for nearly a year now to no avail (although
>> ASU is still a possibility, but it also brings new complications and
>> limitations)
>>
>> Translation: Except for relying on the good graces of Club Rio, there is
> no
>> backup or alternate unless AZIPA finds a way to be prepared to pay for
>> meeting space in the future...
>>
>> But, by collecting voluntary fees and voluntary support now, we can
>> prudently plan and be prepared for future eventualities.
>>
>> Furthermore, the Club Rio location does not have a good sound system for
>> spoken presentations (it is instead optimized for booming dance music),
>> which is one of the reasons why we have gone to a Showcase format there
>> instead of our traditional mix of different meeting formats. And,
>> experience (at the Bash at Ash and The Web Theatre) has repeatedly shown
>> that in order to have a spoken presentation with such a large group, a
>> separate area/room (for people who instead wish to talk and network with
>> one another instead of listening to the speaker) must be available as well
>> - otherwise we end up with half the room trying to listen to the speaker
>> over the noise of the other half of the room who is trying to talk with
> one
>> another - with the only result that each side gets mad at the other. The
>> layout of Club Rio does not permit such a separation, which is yet another
>> reason why we have gone to a Showcase format there instead of our
>> traditional mix of different meeting formats.
>>
>> So, without revenue to pay for better meeting space, we are stuck at the
>> Club Rio location (or another even less desirable location with even more
>> complications) and are totally at the mercy of Club Rio and are also stuck
>> doing Showcases.
>>
>> As said in the email which announced the change to a voluntary fee system:
>>
>> With the mission of being the catalyst to bring the
>> Arizona internet community closer together so as to help
>> enable it to do great things, we have always tried to keep
>> the threshold for participation as low as possible.
>>
>> Thus, for well over two years now, AZIPA has never charged
>> fees or dues of any kind.
>>
>> But, this has obviously also limited what we can do as
>> a group and as a community.
>>
>> Thus, while keeping the option of no fees for
>> participation as a very integral part of AZIPA (so that
>> no one is ever barred due to financial reasons), we
>> will start requesting completely optional and voluntary
>> fees for participation in AZIPA activities.
>>
>> Thus, once again, it remains completely and totally free to you unless you
>> care to be bothered to chip in and help enable the group to once again do
>> those things which you complain that we are no longer doing.
>>
>> Amazing that when a group such as AZIPA, which has created such great
> value
>> for the community, yet which has been totally free for everyone for over
>> two years now (thanks to consistently being able to find new creative ways
>> to be able to remain that way) is no longer able to fully sustain that
>> model, and thus asks you for your completely optional and voluntary help,
>> you instead complain.
>>
>> Thank you very much for your support.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> -Ed
>>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> > Will there be no old formats - only Showcases? Guess that solves it for
> me.
>> > :) I won't be coming. Borrrrring. :)
>> >
>> > Showcases are great... occaissionally. But if that is all AZIPA is
> now,
>> > then I guess I'll wait until something new comes along.
>> >
>> > I would be glad to pay for admission to hear good speakers, panels,
> talks,
>> > or join in a moderated roundtable, but I'm dissapointed by the recent
> string
>> > of "Showcases."
>> >
>> > I hope other options become available.
>> >
>> > Sincerely,
>> >
>> >
>> > Cindy Fox
>> > Computer Training Solutions
>> > www.azcts.com
>> > www.cindyfox.com
>> > (602) 692-8923
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Arizona Internet Professionals Association" <egroups@azipa.com>
>> > To: <azipa-announce@egroups.com>
>> > Sent: Friday, December 29, 2000 1:06 AM
>> > Subject: [azipa-announce] *** Important AZIPA Update (and New Year
> Tidings!)
>> > ***
>> >
>> >
>> >> Season's Greetings from the Arizona Internet Professionals
>> >> Association!
>> >>
>> >> With the New Year right around the corner, many of us,
>> >> including us here at AZIPA, have taken some time to reflect
>> >> upon the past and the future...
>> >>
>> >> With the mission of being the catalyst to bring the
>> >> Arizona internet community closer together so as to help
>> >> enable it to do great things, we have always tried to keep
>> >> the threshold for participation as low as possible.
>> >>
>> >> Thus, for well over two years now, AZIPA has never charged
>> >> fees or dues of any kind.
>> >>
>> >> But, this has obviously also limited what we can do as
>> >> a group and as a community.
>> >>
>> >> Thus, while keeping the option of no fees for
>> >> participation as a very integral part of AZIPA (so that
>> >> no one is ever barred due to financial reasons), we
>> >> will start requesting completely optional and voluntary
>> >> fees for participation in AZIPA activities.
>> >>
>> >> Please see http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa for full
>> >> details.
>> >>
>> >> Thank you, and may you and yours have a very prosperous
>> >> and Happy New Year!
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA
>> >> http://www.azipa.org
>> >> Arizona Internet Professionals Association
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ==========================================================
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA - Arizona Internet Professionals Association
>> >>
>> >> Please be sure to RSVP! http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> INVITATION
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> Invitation to AZIPA Monthly Event - Monday, January 22nd.
>> >>
>> >> Stop by right after work for Happy Hour food and beverage!
>> >> Doors open at 5:30pm. Location info is below.
>> >>
>> >> Please freely extend this invitation to others who may
>> >> also be interested.
>> >>
>> >> Please be sure to RSVP! http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> WHO ATTENDS?
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> If they are involved in the New Economy and do internet
>> >> related stuff (or work with those who do!), then you
>> >> will find them at AZIPA...
>> >>
>> >> Entrepreneurs, Tech People, Angel Investors, Newspaper
>> >> Reporters, Venture Capitalists, Business Types, Service
>> >> Providers, Consultants, Programmers, Designers, Coders,
>> >> Network Dude(tte)s, System Admins, Linux Heads,
>> >> Government Representatives, Marketing and Sales Gurus,
>> >> Recent Grads, Accountants, Lawyers, Webmasters,
>> >> Educators, Students, Graphic Artists, Hardware Pros,
>> >> Journalists, Economic Development Departments, Job
>> >> Seekers, Employers, Suppliers, Customers, Partners, etc.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> THANK YOU TO THIS MONTH'S AZIPA SPONSORS AND SUPPORTERS!
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> stealthmode.com - http://www.stealthmode.com
>> >> Greenberg Traurig, LLP - http://www.gtlaw.com
>> >> Business Journal of Phoenix -
>> >> http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix
>> >> Opnix - http://www.opnix.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> THIS MONTH'S EVENT
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> This month's event will be an AZIPA Company Showcase
>> >> - which is a great way to see some of the really cool
>> >> and useful internet related stuff that is happening
>> >> right here in Arizona - and find potential partners,
>> >> customers, employees, investors, suppliers, affiliates,
>> >> employers, etc, etc, etc.
>> >>
>> >> We have over 50 great companies in this month's AZIPA
>> >> Showcase!
>> >>
>> >> Note that a preference is given to industry companies
>> >> that have not participated before - so there is always
>> >> something new and different to come and see and
>> >> discover! For a list of companies and organizations
>> >> who have requested Showcase space and/or have
>> >> participated in prior AZIPA Company Showcases, see
>> >> http://www.azipa.org/meetings.html
>> >>
>> >> Please be sure to RSVP! http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa
>> >>
>> >> If your company is interested in participating in a
>> >> future AZIPA Company Showcase, please sign up as
>> >> soon as possible (space fills up incredibly fast!)
>> >> http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa
>> >>
>> >> Suggestions on possible future speakers or events?
>> >> Send an email to our Speakers Committee
>> >> <mailto:speak@azipa.org>
>> >>
>> >> Interested in sponsoring future AZIPA events? First,
>> >> check out the options at http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa.
>> >> If you are interested in something that is not listed,
>> >> then please send an email with your request to our
>> >> Sponsors Committee <mailto:sponsor@azipa.org>. Thanks!
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> LOCATION OF THIS MONTH'S EVENT
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> WHERE: Club Rio - 430 N. Scottsdale Road in Tempe -
>> >> on the west side of Scottsdale Road, just south
>> >> of Route 202 and just north of Tempe Town Lake
>> >> (Rio Salado / Salt River).
>> >>
>> >> Please be sure to RSVP! http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa
>> >>
>> >> (If the line map below is in disarray, please view
>> >> with a mono/single spaced font)
>> >>
>> >> |
>> >> ___________________________|_______Route 202
>> >> |
>> >> |
>> >> <_____<_____<___|
>> >> _________ |
>> >> Parking | | |
>> >> Parking | CLUB | | Scottsdale Road
>> >> Parking * RIO | | (/ Rural Road)
>> >> Parking |_______| |
>> >> |
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|~~~~~~~~
>> >> ~~~~~ Tempe Town Lake ~~~~~|~~~~~~~~
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|~~~~~~~~
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|~~~~~~~~
>> >> |
>> >>
>> >> See http://www.azipa.org/meetings.html for a more
>> >> detailed map (* is Club Rio Main Entrance)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA NUMBERS
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> 2000+ Arizona internet professionals are currently
>> >> subscribed to the AZIPA email Discussion List (see
>> >> below) and 7500+ Arizona internet professionals are
>> >> on the general Announcement List. The first AZIPA
>> >> meeting was held in September of 1998 - thus we are
>> >> now well over two years old! Our recent monthly
>> >> events have averaged 600+ attendees.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA DISCUSSION MAIL LIST
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> Whether you can make it to our events or not, be
>> >> sure to sign up for our Discussion Mail List - it
>> >> is 2000+ other Arizona internet professionals
>> >> helping each other do great internet related things
>> >> in Arizona each and every day!
>> >>
>> >> Subscribe at http://www.egroups.com/group/azipa
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA ANNOUNCEMENT LIST
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> If you did not receive this email directly from AZIPA,
>> >> please be sure to add yourself to our low frequency
>> >> email Announcement List (usually 2-3 emails a month)
>> >> so that you can be sure to receive the latest meeting
>> >> time and location information directly from the source!
>> >> <mailto:meetings@azipa.org>
>> >>
>> >> To be removed from this general announcement list, simply
>> >> reply with the word "unsubscribe" in the subject line.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> MARK YOUR CALENDARS NOW!
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> AZIPA monthly events for 2001 are tentatively scheduled
>> >> for the evenings of:
>> >>
>> >> Monday, January 22
>> >> Monday, February 26
>> >> Monday, March 26
>> >> Monday, April 23
>> >> Monday, May 21 (Third Monday)
>> >> Monday, June 25
>> >> Monday, July 23
>> >> Monday, August 27
>> >> Monday, September 24
>> >> Monday, October 22
>> >> Monday, November 12 (Second Monday)
>> >> Monday, December 10 (Second Monday)
>> >>
>> >> All meetings start at 5:30pm and are usually the fourth
>> >> Monday of each month (except for the third Monday in May
>> >> and second Mondays in November and December so as to
>> >> avoid conflicts with holidays). As dates and locations
>> >> are subject to change, please be sure to sign up for our
>> >> low frequency (2-3 emails a month) email Announcement
>> >> List so as to make sure to get the very latest updates
>> >> directly from the source! <mailto:meetings@azipa.org>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA WHAT AND WHY
>> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >> Get Together - Learn Together - Work Together
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA is the catalyst for people doing internet related
>> >> work in Arizona to get together, learn together, work
>> >> together, and do great internet related things together.
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA is purposely cross-functional (business, technology,
>> >> art, finance, law, education, government, etc, etc, etc...)
>> >> so as to enable people to do great internet related things
>> >> in Arizona - no matter what they may be...
>> >>
>> >> There are many people involved in internet related
>> >> careers and businesses here in Arizona - but nowhere
>> >> near the critical mass found in Silicon Valley where
>> >> you can go into almost any bar or coffee shop and be
>> >> able to talk Net and Web and spark that great idea,
>> >> start a new company, find that new employee/employer/
>> >> subcontractor/supplier/customer/investor/etc.
>> >>
>> >> AZIPA's goal is to help bring the Arizona internet
>> >> community closer together to help create our own
>> >> critical mass.
>> >>
>> >> You are cordially invited to join us in building a
>> >> stronger community of Internet professionals here
>> >> in Arizona.
>> >>
>> >> Hope to see you at the next meeting!
>> >>
>> >> Please be sure to RSVP! http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa
>> >>
>> >> Arizona Internet Professionals Association - AZIPA
>> >> http://www.azipa.org -- mailto:info@azipa.org
==AZIPA=============================================================
Arizona Internet Professionals Association http://www.azipa.org
Next AZIPA monthly meeting is 5:30pm on Monday, January 22nd, 2001
Please be sure to RSVP! http://www.acteva.com/go/azipa
Other upcoming events:
Tempe Tech Oasis Techie Tuesday - 6:00pm, Tuesday 1/9/01
Beeloe's Cafe & Bar, 501 S. Mill Ave Tempe (SE corner of 5th)
Strategic Research Institute Web Launch BootCamp - 1/30-2/2/01
http://www.srinstitute.com/cx326
=============================================================AZIPA==
